Are you "naturally good"? Naturally bad? Somewhere in between?
Can you picture yourself being any other way than what you are? Created differently? Would you want that?
You are who you are with all your faults and strengths.
You're not alone. What and who we are is out of God's control EXCEPT for the fact that He has given commandments and laws that CAN help us to change our natures to become more like he is.
He cannot create us in perfected form. We are a product of biology and what we came with...and then we interact with our environment. Lots of moving parts. In a world of chaotic interactions. God cannot control everything that happens.
But He can allow for what happens and correct for it.
Atonement of Jesus Christ.
Regards,
MG
You seem to be conflating “can’t” with “won’t” and in doing so you render your God as something other than an actual God.
So was your Lord and Saviour not naturally all good when he was on the earth? A simple yes or no is all that’s required.
Yes. By the nature of who He was, a perfect being, He was "all good". He went through His mortal sojourn grace upon grace and did so perfectly. That's who he WAS.
He was the only one to ever be so and do so on this earth.
You sound like the people on one side of the dais in a U.S. Congressional Committee Hearing. "A simple yes or no please." They do not want to hear 'the rest of the story'.
Nod to Paul Harvey. Some here will remember him.
Have you ever considered that it might be you who has a general misconception of God and the nature of human beings?
You seem to be conflating “can’t” with “won’t” and in doing so you render your God as something other than an actual God.
So was your Lord and Saviour not naturally all good when he was on the earth? A simple yes or no is all that’s required.
Yes. By the nature of who He was, a perfect being, He was "all good". He went through His mortal sojourne grace upon grace and did so perfectly. That's who he WAS.
He was the only one to ever be so and do so on this earth.
You sound like the people on one side of the dias in a U.S. Congressional Committee Hearing. "A simple yes or no please." They do not want to hear 'the rest of the story'.
Nod to Paul Harvey. Some here will remember him.
Have you ever considered that it might be you who has a general misconception of God and the nature of human beings?
Regards,
MG
MG, does it strike you as strange or at least a curious puzzle that Jesus had a lock on good which absolutely none of the rest of us has. Is that an accident or is there some fundamental reason? Accident does not make sense something more fundamental would seem to be implied.
Yes. By the nature of who He was, a perfect being, He was "all good". He went through His mortal sojourne grace upon grace and did so perfectly. That's who he WAS.
He was the only one to ever be so and do so on this earth.
You sound like the people on one side of the dias in a U.S. Congressional Committee Hearing. "A simple yes or no please." They do not want to hear 'the rest of the story'.
Nod to Paul Harvey. Some here will remember him.
Have you ever considered that it might be you who has a general misconception of God and the nature of human beings?
Regards,
MG
MG, does it strike you as strange or at least a curious puzzle that Jesus had a lock on good which absolutely none of the rest of us has. Is that an accident or is there some fundamental reason? Accident does not make sense something more fundamental would seem to be implied.
It is an overpowering thought to consider that there may have been an intelligence/Spirit/God-human that could have been perfect on all counts. Perfect meaning that He grew from grace to grace being perfectly attuned to making correct choices between the good and evil that is in this world.
I think it is also rather obvious that there have been a lot of other humans that have been pretty close to having achieved the ability to choose good over evil...and yet they sinned.
As the scriptures say, all come short of the glory of God.
Jesus didn't. That's something that is taken on faith. But that's not too hard knowing that Jesus apparently had achieved a godly state before He came to the earth.
Seeing examples of others that do a lot better at this 'perfection gig' than I do makes me think that Jesus could have aced it.
You seem to be conflating “can’t” with “won’t” and in doing so you render your God as something other than an actual God.
So was your Lord and Saviour not naturally all good when he was on the earth? A simple yes or no is all that’s required.
Yes. By the nature of who He was, a perfect being, He was "all good".
But this is the opposite of your assertion that your God is incapable of creating someone who is naturally all good.
1. God created Jesus Christ
2. Jesus Christ was naturally all good.
3. Therefore God is capable of creating someone who is naturally all good.
You just rebutted your own opinion.
Premise 1. Eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable.
Premise 2. The best evidence for the Book of Mormon is eyewitness testimony.
Conclusion. Therefore, the best evidence for the Book of Mormon is notoriously unreliable.
Yes. By the nature of who He was, a perfect being, He was "all good".
But this is the opposite of your assertion that your God is incapable of creating someone who is naturally all good.
1. God created Jesus Christ
2. Jesus Christ was naturally all good.
3. Therefore God is capable of creating someone who is naturally all good.
You just rebutted your own opinion.
MG's comment sounds like Jesus perfected himself by his own effort ,he was not created that way. In fact he and us were not created at all. If that is the case Jesus is a good example but it is unclear what value atonement would have. We like him must perfect ourselves.
There is variety but Christian thought normally has God sharing something of himself through Jesus. I do not know if LDS thought excludes that but it might slip by sometimes.
But this is the opposite of your assertion that your God is incapable of creating someone who is naturally all good.
1. God created Jesus Christ
2. Jesus Christ was naturally all good.
3. Therefore God is capable of creating someone who is naturally all good.
You just rebutted your own opinion.
MG's comment sounds like Jesus perfected himself by his own effort ,he was not created that way. In fact he and us were not created at all. If that is the case Jesus is a good example but it is unclear what value atonement would have. We like him must perfect ourselves.
There is variety but Christian thought normally has God sharing something of himself through Jesus. I do not know if LDS thought excludes that but it might slip by sometimes.
I think it’s also stated pretty clearly that everyone except Jesus falls short and fails to perfect themselves as Jesus. This I think this is why there is such an emphasis on taking the name of Jesus upon oneself. For example, you dress in the high priest robes (Jesus being the great High Priest according to Hebrews) in the temple preparatory to the symbolic encounter with God just as Nephi dressed as Laban to fool Zoram and like Jacob dressed like Esau to fool Isaac. Obviously there is no fooling God, rather it seems the whole thing was supposedly His idea from the beginning.
“The ego is not master in its own house.” - Sigmund Freud