SeN: Child Abusers Deserve Clergy Protection?

[Doctor Scratch]

I see that the Afore is predictably doubling down and claiming that all he did was post links to articles suggesting that mandated reporting by clergy “isn’t the answer.” Remember, though, that at the outset he was plugging a FAIR Conference talk that claimed that the Church hotline “is as valuable a tool as exists in the world to protect children.” So this is presented as something that is *better* and *more effective* than mandated reporting.

But like I said, this seems incredibly irresponsible, and it’s also disingenuous. There is literally no way that, if (God forbid) something like this happened to one of the Proprietor’s loved ones, that he would be satisfied with merely dialing up that phone number. Sure: he’s happy to pedal this as a viable solution to his readers, but there is literally no way that if he was confronted with a tragedy like this, that he’d put his faith in the Church’s lawyers and bureaucrats. Or, hey: let him prove me wrong—he can openly tell his readers how much he trusts the Church, and that yea, absolutely, if he found himself facing a horrific situation like this, he would trust the “hotline.”

[Everybody Wang Chung]

The most absurd comment I read on reddit about the clergy penitent privilege issue was from a Mormon arguing that the Mormon version was better than the catholic version because while catholics are required to maintain confidentiality, Mormons can use the ward structure to prevent abusers from having access to children... which of course means confidentiality is broken. Which, also of course, means there is no clergy penitent privilege in the LDS church. Mormons have always broken 'privilege', it wasn't until lawyers needed it in court to get LDS leaders and the LDS church off the hook for abuse that it became a thing.

Peterson's excuses are just as meaningless.

On another note, how do Kirton McConkie lawyers live with themselves? What a sickening way to make a living--defending the system that allows child abuse to flourish.

It's disgusting. I have no idea how they live with themselves.

[Gadianton]

I see that the Afore is predictably doubling down and claiming that all he did was post links to articles suggesting that mandated reporting by clergy “isn’t the answer.” Remember, though, that at the outset he was plugging a FAIR Conference talk that claimed that the Church hotline “is as valuable a tool as exists in the world to protect children.” So this is presented as something that is *better* and *more effective* than mandated reporting.

But like I said, this seems incredibly irresponsible, and it’s also disingenuous. There is literally no way that, if (God forbid) something like this happened to one of the Proprietor’s loved ones, that he would be satisfied with merely dialing up that phone number. Sure: he’s happy to pedal this as a viable solution to his readers, but there is literally no way that if he was confronted with a tragedy like this, that he’d put his faith in the Church’s lawyers and bureaucrats. Or, hey: let him prove me wrong—he can openly tell his readers how much he trusts the Church, and that yea, absolutely, if he found himself facing a horrific situation like this, he would trust the “hotline.”

I get the feeling when I read this stuff, it isn't any one particular point, but that these apologists don't really care if the problem is happening, but care deeply if anybody says the Church is in the wrong. Oh, woe is me.

[Doctor Scratch]

I see that the Afore is predictably doubling down and claiming that all he did was post links to articles suggesting that mandated reporting by clergy “isn’t the answer.” Remember, though, that at the outset he was plugging a FAIR Conference talk that claimed that the Church hotline “is as valuable a tool as exists in the world to protect children.” So this is presented as something that is *better* and *more effective* than mandated reporting.

But like I said, this seems incredibly irresponsible, and it’s also disingenuous. There is literally no way that, if (God forbid) something like this happened to one of the Proprietor’s loved ones, that he would be satisfied with merely dialing up that phone number. Sure: he’s happy to pedal this as a viable solution to his readers, but there is literally no way that if he was confronted with a tragedy like this, that he’d put his faith in the Church’s lawyers and bureaucrats. Or, hey: let him prove me wrong—he can openly tell his readers how much he trusts the Church, and that yea, absolutely, if he found himself facing a horrific situation like this, he would trust the “hotline.”

I get the feeling when I read this stuff, it isn't any one particular point, but that these apologists don't really care if the problem is happening, but care deeply if anybody says the Church is in the wrong. Oh, woe is me.

Exactly. The blog post wasn’t prompted by the fact that kids are being abused. The Afore decided he needed to speak up because critics were saying something in the Comments section of some article. (And actually, what they were criticizing was a FAIR Conference talk….)

[Rivendale]

I see that the Afore is predictably doubling down and claiming that all he did was post links to articles suggesting that mandated reporting by clergy “isn’t the answer.” Remember, though, that at the outset he was plugging a FAIR Conference talk that claimed that the Church hotline “is as valuable a tool as exists in the world to protect children.” So this is presented as something that is *better* and *more effective* than mandated reporting.

But like I said, this seems incredibly irresponsible, and it’s also disingenuous. There is literally no way that, if (God forbid) something like this happened to one of the Proprietor’s loved ones, that he would be satisfied with merely dialing up that phone number. Sure: he’s happy to pedal this as a viable solution to his readers, but there is literally no way that if he was confronted with a tragedy like this, that he’d put his faith in the Church’s lawyers and bureaucrats. Or, hey: let him prove me wrong—he can openly tell his readers how much he trusts the Church, and that yea, absolutely, if he found himself facing a horrific situation like this, he would trust the “hotline.”

I get the feeling when I read this stuff, it isn't any one particular point, but that these apologists don't really care if the problem is happening, but care deeply if anybody says the Church is in the wrong. Oh, woe is me.

I think part of the disconnect deals with the sample space. There may be statistical evidence that on the broader scope of abuse cases mandated reporting may not be as significant. But not with the closed system that the church operates under where the instructions are clear and detailed. Call the hotline. That step right there circumnavigates any other (perhaps more efficient) procedure.

[Gadianton]

I think part of the disconnect deals with the sample space. There may be statistical evidence that on the broader scope of abuse cases mandated reporting may not be as significant. But not with the closed system that the church operates under where the instructions are clear and detailed. Call the hotline. That step right there circumnavigates any other (perhaps more efficient) procedure.

I think you're right, my experience in the corporate world is that any time a company must save itself from some legal debacle, they declare 30 minutes of mandatory training for everyone and make a hotline available. It's all about deniability. "I find it surprising this terrible thing happened, my God, we had a hotline available and everything, yet still?"

[drumdude]

The child abuse stuff is truly sick. The church is in the wrong.

But this reply? LOL, what is going on here?

The exmormon reddit regularly has topics on this, you didn't see them there?

He's giving Kyler Rasmussen vibes occasionally lol

Maybe it's just the photo of a perpetual missionary Elder that never grew up which is associating the two in my mind

[Nolan]

The child abuse stuff is truly sick. The church is in the wrong.

But this reply? LOL, what is going on here?

The exmormon reddit regularly has topics on this, you didn't see them there?

On what?

-Kyle Rasmussen

(Just kidding)

[drumdude]

KyleR. His parents were very cruel.

[Nolan]

KyleR. His parents were very cruel.

Or just Utah Mormon.