God can write straight with crooked lines.

[Gadianton]

To put things another way, God making crooked lines straight seems to be one kind of job that scripture has.

Life is crooked for the subjects of scripture in order to be straight for the reader of scripture. Scripture tries to get ahead of ambiguity to give the reader a simple answer. This doesn't work out cleanly because scriptures are compiled over centuries and longer, there's a huge amount of cultural context, but the intent I think is to make a life of trust in authorities a simple choice.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

To put things another way, God making crooked lines straight seems to be one kind of job that scripture has.

Life is crooked for the subjects of scripture in order to be straight for the reader of scripture. Scripture tries to get ahead of ambiguity to give the reader a simple answer. This doesn't work out cleanly because scriptures are compiled over centuries and longer, there's a huge amount of cultural context, but the intent I think is to make a life of trust in authorities a simple choice.

That’s it in a nutshell. It’s designed to train the mind to bend the knee to authority figures, and pay for the right to do so.

[MG 2.0]

To put things another way, God making crooked lines straight seems to be one kind of job that scripture has.

Restoration scripture, especially The Book of Mormon acts as a parallel ‘straightedge’ to the Bible. It uses very explicit, almost legalistic language to define doctrines that the Bible leaves ambiguous. The Book of Mormon provides a "New World" witness that mirrors the "Old World" one, effectively triangulating a straight line. What was crooked in some ways has been made straight.

Life is crooked for the subjects of scripture in order to be straight for the reader of scripture. Scripture tries to get ahead of ambiguity to give the reader a simple answer. This doesn't work out cleanly because scriptures are compiled over centuries and longer, there's a huge amount of cultural context, but the intent I think is to make a life of trust in authorities a simple choice.

Where/when there are questions about straight vs. crookedness in the scriptures, you’re right, that is what a prophet (authorities) are for. Essentially continuing that ‘triangulating process’ in real time. Cultural context does play a large part in that triangulation. And it’s ongoing.

Regards,
MG

[Marcus]

"…a parallel ‘straightedge’ …that mirrors…, effectively triangulating a straight line... in real time.
…And it’s ongoing."

Sometimes you just have to laugh.

[bill4long]

"…a parallel ‘straightedge’ …that mirrors…, effectively triangulating a straight line... in real time.
…And it’s ongoing."

Sometimes you just have to laugh.

Just sometimes?

[I Have Questions]

To put things another way, God making crooked lines straight seems to be one kind of job that scripture has.

Restoration scripture, especially The Book of Mormon acts as a parallel ‘straightedge’ to the Bible. It uses very explicit, almost legalistic language to define doctrines that the Bible leaves ambiguous. The Book of Mormon provides a "New World" witness that mirrors the "Old World" one, effectively triangulating a straight line. What was crooked in some ways has been made straight.

Life is crooked for the subjects of scripture in order to be straight for the reader of scripture. Scripture tries to get ahead of ambiguity to give the reader a simple answer. This doesn't work out cleanly because scriptures are compiled over centuries and longer, there's a huge amount of cultural context, but the intent I think is to make a life of trust in authorities a simple choice.

Where/when there are questions about straight vs. crookedness in the scriptures, you’re right, that is what a prophet (authorities) are for. Essentially continuing that ‘triangulating process’ in real time. Cultural context does play a large part in that triangulation. And it’s ongoing.

Regards,
MG

MG, that’s circular reasoning, even if it’s dressed up as metaphor. A straightedge cannot prove itself straight by correcting something else when neither has been demonstrated to be straight, nor crooked. You are all over place. In your history of making laughably incoherent arguments this one is right up there with the daftest. Please keep posting this stuff, it’s highly entertaining.

[bill4long]

Restoration scripture, especially The Book of Mormon acts as a parallel ‘straightedge’ to the Bible. It uses very explicit, almost legalistic language to define doctrines that the Bible leaves ambiguous. The Book of Mormon provides a "New World" witness that mirrors the "Old World" one, effectively triangulating a straight line. What was crooked in some ways has been made straight.

…
Where/when there are questions about straight vs. crookedness in the scriptures, you’re right, that is what a prophet (authorities) are for. Essentially continuing that ‘triangulating process’ in real time. Cultural context does play a large part in that triangulation. And it’s ongoing.

Regards,
MG

MG, that’s circular reasoning, even if it’s dressed up as metaphor. A straightedge cannot prove itself straight by correcting something else when neither has been demonstrated to be straight, nor crooked. You are all over place. In your history of making laughably incoherent arguments this one is right up there with the daftest. Please keep posting this stuff, it’s highly entertaining.

I'm guessing that Muslims and Hindus would take exception with MG to what scripture is the "straight" one.

[Limnor]

To put things another way, God making crooked lines straight seems to be one kind of job that scripture has.

Restoration scripture, especially The Book of Mormon acts as a parallel ‘straightedge’ to the Bible. It uses very explicit, almost legalistic language to define doctrines that the Bible leaves ambiguous. The Book of Mormon provides a "New World" witness that mirrors the "Old World" one, effectively triangulating a straight line. What was crooked in some ways has been made straight.

Life is crooked for the subjects of scripture in order to be straight for the reader of scripture. Scripture tries to get ahead of ambiguity to give the reader a simple answer. This doesn't work out cleanly because scriptures are compiled over centuries and longer, there's a huge amount of cultural context, but the intent I think is to make a life of trust in authorities a simple choice.

Where/when there are questions about straight vs. crookedness in the scriptures, you’re right, that is what a prophet (authorities) are for. Essentially continuing that ‘triangulating process’ in real time. Cultural context does play a large part in that triangulation. And it’s ongoing.

Regards,
MG

If ambiguity counts as crookedness, then the Book of Mormon requiring continual prophetic correction is at least as crooked as the Bible it claims to straighten.

[Rivendale]

Restoration scripture, especially The Book of Mormon acts as a parallel ‘straightedge’ to the Bible. It uses very explicit, almost legalistic language to define doctrines that the Bible leaves ambiguous. The Book of Mormon provides a "New World" witness that mirrors the "Old World" one, effectively triangulating a straight line. What was crooked in some ways has been made straight.

…
Where/when there are questions about straight vs. crookedness in the scriptures, you’re right, that is what a prophet (authorities) are for. Essentially continuing that ‘triangulating process’ in real time. Cultural context does play a large part in that triangulation. And it’s ongoing.

Regards,
MG

If ambiguity counts as crookedness, then the Book of Mormon requiring continual prophetic correction is at least as crooked as the Bible it claims to straighten.

The Book of Mormon is fractally crooked. It does repeat patterns like "and it came to pass" or as others have said "I crap you not".

[MG 2.0]

Restoration scripture, especially The Book of Mormon acts as a parallel ‘straightedge’ to the Bible. It uses very explicit, almost legalistic language to define doctrines that the Bible leaves ambiguous. The Book of Mormon provides a "New World" witness that mirrors the "Old World" one, effectively triangulating a straight line. What was crooked in some ways has been made straight.

…
Where/when there are questions about straight vs. crookedness in the scriptures, you’re right, that is what a prophet (authorities) are for. Essentially continuing that ‘triangulating process’ in real time. Cultural context does play a large part in that triangulation. And it’s ongoing.

Regards,
MG

If ambiguity counts as crookedness, then the Book of Mormon requiring continual prophetic correction is at least as crooked as the Bible it claims to straighten.

Or on the other hand one could look at the Bible, Book of Mormon, and living prophets forming a mutually reinforcing network of testimonies, comparable to multiple independent measurements that together give confidence in a line of evidence. The prophetic utterances and the scriptural straightening that happens in conjunction with the Book of Mormon being placed parallel with the Bible (assuming the Bible is not inerrant) can't prove themselves except through the inner witness of the Spirit and the pragmatic 'fruits' in the lives of adherents (those living the Gospel of Jesus Christ).

It is these additional evidences that the straightedges are in alignment with reality. Those evidences, of course, cannot be handed to someone else as absolute evidence. A testimony can only be shared.

On another thread I asked Physics Guy some questions having to do with epistemology. I'm hoping he will respond. We continue to go back and forth on what epistemology is going to rule the day or if there are any possible compromises. What counts as good reasons for believing LDS truth claims are actually true and how do we know when a straightedge is actually straight?

Critics want a straightedge whose accuracy can be tested from outside the LDS system, not only from within. Earlier a poster said that my arguments are circular. At the end of the day there is truth to that assertion. The truthiness can only be experienced from living inside the system, not outside. The circular logic resides inside the system. At its core the truths of the LDS church are only discernable through certain epistemological frameworks that include spiritual experience, convergence of reason and revelation, coherence of 'everything put together' (what I've called global/macro rather than simply focusing on the micro), and pragmatic experience in living the gospel.

Regards,
MG