malkie wrote:O MG - I just have to comment directly on this one.
Do you know what's worse than a "poster that clips, pastes, and uses ellipses"? One who clips, pastes, and fails to use ellipses to indicate that he has removed/ignored a lot of material. The one that you see when you look in the mirror. It's one of your common practices on this board.
Sure, you'll say that you're not the only one doing that, but it's a bit rich for you to make that complaint. Mote & beam.
ETA: I've been assuming that you know why writers use ellipses - was my belief misplaced?
MG wrote:Thanks. I might have hoped to get a reply with a bit more ‘meat’…something substantial regarding my earlier comments…alas, that is/was not to be.
Once again MG exemplifies the behaviour he has been complaining about.
My evidence-based assumptions from this - implied "and/or" for each assumption:
MG is whining again
MG does not understand that he is (and has been) guilty of behaviour he dislikes when (he claims) others do it
MG has no idea what ellipses are used for
MG is determined not to use ellipses when they are appropriate
MG doesn't understand that my comment was a reply to his complaint
MG is simply trolling - there, the first time I've said that
Last edited by malkie on Fri Apr 10, 2026 2:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Paragraphs should not be isolated. They ought to be looked at within the context of everything else that is being said.
That is a constant problem here. Especially with one poster that clips, pastes, and uses ellipses. On top of that, then reinterpreting most of what I said into something that sounds almost the opposite of what I said.
Crazy.
Look at things that EVERYONE says in context of the surrounding paragraphs. Especially if there is more than one paragraph. (I know this sounds contradictory, but gosh, a reader actually did just that.
I'll bow out to let other make comment on my paragraph...but please don't leave out, as was done, the rest of what I said.
Thanks in advance.
Regards,
MG
O MG - I just have to comment directly on this one.
Do you know what's worse than a "poster that clips, pastes, and uses ellipses"? One who clips, pastes, and fails to use ellipses to indicate that he has removed/ignored a lot of material. The one that you see when you look in the mirror. It's one of your common practices on this board.
Sure, you'll say that you're not the only one doing that, but it's a bit rich for you to make that complaint. Mote & beam.
ETA: I've been assuming that you know why writers use ellipses - was my belief misplaced?
I think he does, but who knows. He's certainly abused the concept to his benefit repeatedly.
This comment recently appeared on a Prominent Apologist's blog:
Emblematic, I think, of this undercurrent of entropy, is not just the cloudy situation around our statistics, but the substantive doctrinal drift I've seen in Gen Z. They have made of themselves acolytes of Blake Ostler, rather than Pres. Young, something I find both bizarre and possessed of a sort of intellectual elitism, which recovers in large part as far as I can tell, the God of Greek and Medieval Philosophers.
Boundaries of ontology dashed to pieces by Joseph rebuilt and refortified under new terms, and it seems to me that it is not easily disassociated from the lackadaisical approach young people may be taking towards various aspects of Church custom and moral calculus. Between the extraordinary desire to wear less clothes, indulge in tattoos and accrue piercings, and this domination of a particular non-authoritative philosophical mind, the Church is rapidly becoming something radically divergent from what I recall only 10 years ago. Not merely in means of implementation, but in doctrine as well. I cannot easily divorce this orthodoxic drift, from the other issues I'm seeing.
More and more Mormons and ex-Mormons are realizing this to be true: "the Church is rapidly becoming something radically divergent from what I recall only 10 years ago."
Last Friday, James White was in a debate on Calvinism with Jacob Hansen. Jacob Hansen is part of this Gen Z group, you could call them "Ostlerites."
Now it's not uncommon for Mormons to shirk away from defending the Mormon conception of God. Because that conception of God is fundamentally different and incompatible with traditional Christianity. But Hansen was ill-prepared to deal with James White pressing him on it.
White got Jacob to admit he thinks the King Follet Discourse was just an incorrect opinion. That the temple ceremony is metaphorical. Elohim and Jehovah are just characters in a symbolic liturgical rite.
All of this fits into the larger trend of Mormons distancing themselves from the distinctive teachings of Mormonism, trying to shrink Mormonism down into just another generic Christian denomination.
I wrote a response here earlier but somehow it didn't post. I am reconsidering
I watched the whole debate and found it s somewhat revealing picture of Mr White. I did not think Jacod Hansen really attempted a presentation of Mormon understanding of God. In fact I saw him trying hard to avoid that and appeal to a basic understanding of love. This clashed with Whites mistrust of human experience preferring to assume the Bible is unmediated and pure truth directly from God who is real truth not human experience.
In that context I did not think Mormon understanding of how God has power and authority, curious questions in themselves ,is necessary. I think Hansen correct love is discovered not by divine command or law but human experience of relationships and growth.
Last edited by huckelberry on Fri Apr 10, 2026 5:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
Once again MG exemplifies the behaviour he has been complaining about.
My evidence-based assumptions from this - implied "and/or" for each assumption:
MG is whining again
MG does not understand that he is (and has been) guilty of behaviour he dislikes when (he claims) others do it
MG has no idea what ellipses are used for
MG is determined not to use ellipses when they are appropriate
MG doesn't understand that my comment was a reply to his complaint
MG is simply trolling - there, the first time I've said that
OK then. Settled case. Judge, jury, and executioner. That's got to be a relief, malkie, to get everything off your chest.
Regards,
MG
I thought this was a thread about Blake Ostler and changing LDS views of God. What the hell has MG have to with it? I mean does every last damn thread have to be about MG? I mean it has gotten truly ridiculous.
This comment recently appeared on a Prominent Apologist's blog:
More and more Mormons and ex-Mormons are realizing this to be true: "the Church is rapidly becoming something radically divergent from what I recall only 10 years ago."
Last Friday, James White was in a debate on Calvinism with Jacob Hansen. Jacob Hansen is part of this Gen Z group, you could call them "Ostlerites."
Now it's not uncommon for Mormons to shirk away from defending the Mormon conception of God. Because that conception of God is fundamentally different and incompatible with traditional Christianity. But Hansen was ill-prepared to deal with James White pressing him on it.
White got Jacob to admit he thinks the King Follet Discourse was just an incorrect opinion. That the temple ceremony is metaphorical. Elohim and Jehovah are just characters in a symbolic liturgical rite.
All of this fits into the larger trend of Mormons distancing themselves from the distinctive teachings of Mormonism, trying to shrink Mormonism down into just another generic Christian denomination.
I wrote a response here earlier but somehow it didn't post. I am reconsidering
I watched the whole debate and found it s somewhat revealing picture of Mr White. I did not think Jacod Hansen really attempted a presentation of Mormon understanding of God. In fact I saw him trying hard to avoid that and appeal to a basic understanding of love. This clashed with Whites mistrust of human experience preferring to assume the Bible is unmediated and pure truth directly from God who is real truth not human experience.
In that context I did not think Mormon understanding of how God has power and authority, curious questions in themselves ,is necessary. I think Hansen correct love is discovered not by divine command or law but human experience of relationships and growth.
I think that Hansen is really defending a kind of secular humanist morality, there wasn’t anything really Christian about it. If you make love and relationships the goal of humanity, that doesn’t require any God.
I’ve been noticing a lot of these prominent online Mormons compartmentalize their LDS faith from their secular beliefs. Hansen says he is agnostic about Noah’s ark due to science. Presumably all the other LDS beliefs that don’t line up with a secular scientific worldview are also segregated into the agnostic category.
In some ways I applaud it, as it’s a sign of a maturing religion. But we have to remember that those in positions of authority haven’t endorsed any of this. It may take generations before they do.
The historicity of the Book of Mormon is just as absurd as a historical Noah’s ark.
The historicity of the Book of Mormon is just as absurd as a historical Noah’s ark.
I don't think you can put these on equal footing. You've made the claim, I think it is incumbent on you to prove your claim.
I think the children's Bible story I grew up with of a global flood with Noah taking all animals from across the whole planet two by two into the ark along with all the varieties of plants is absurd.
On the other hand, I can't say the same thing about the Book of Mormon.
I think you may need to correlate, connect, and then show how each of these are comparably absurd.
OK then. Settled case. Judge, jury, and executioner. That's got to be a relief, malkie, to get everything off your chest.
Regards,
MG
I thought this was a thread about Blake Ostler and changing LDS views of God. What the hell has MG have to with it? I mean does every last damn thread have to be about MG? I mean it has gotten truly ridiculous.
Yes. Do you think you could get MG to stop derailing? Please, give it your best shot.
OK then. Settled case. Judge, jury, and executioner. That's got to be a relief, malkie, to get everything off your chest.
Regards,
MG
I thought this was a thread about Blake Ostler and changing LDS views of God. What the hell has MG have to with it? I mean does every last damn thread have to be about MG? I mean it has gotten truly ridiculous.
You're correct, huckleberry, and I apologize for my part in the derail. Yesterday I wrote an experimental post to try to solve my side of the problem, but got sidetracked. Perhaps later today I'll get it done.
(I know this sounds contradictory, but gosh, a reader actually did just that. 