anti-christ discussion, from middle p. 3 to end.

[dastardly stem]

From things I’ve heard said in regards to Jesus Christ by some on this board at one time or another I would propose that we have those that are anti-Christ among us. That, as I’ve said, doesn’t make them bad people necessarily. They simply hold ideas and beliefs that are opposed to the doctrine of Christ, His mission, His reality, as described in the scriptures.

Regards,
MG

Okay. So are they enemies of Christ or enemies of good? or both?

[mentalgymnast]

From things I’ve heard said in regards to Jesus Christ by some on this board at one time or another I would propose that we have those that are anti-Christ among us. That, as I’ve said, doesn’t make them bad people necessarily. They simply hold ideas and beliefs that are opposed to the doctrine of Christ, His mission, His reality, as described in the scriptures.

Regards,
MG

Okay. So are they enemies of Christ or enemies of good? or both?

Matt. 12:30
He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.

And it’s a matter of degree, as I’ve said.

Mark 3
31Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. 32And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

And to what degree the dividing line is between an antichrist and a non-believer, that’s not an easy question to answer.

Is a person that swears by using the name of Christ an antichrist? I doubt it. They may not even realize what they’re doing. Ignorance. So what makes an enemy of Christ? Well, I think I’ve already given what I think is a reasonable answer. Can an enemy of Christ be a good person? I think I’ve answered that also.

Are atheists the enemies of Christ? Are they antichrists? To some degree I would say probably so even though they themselves would be unlikely to say so. But again, I think if you want to measure it, it’s in degrees. If someone is not out in open opposition then it comes up much lower on the scale.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. I’m open to re-evaluate based on evidence otherwise.

Regards,
MG

[dastardly stem]

Okay. So are they enemies of Christ or enemies of good? or both?

Matt. 12:30
He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.

And it’s a matter of degree, as I’ve said.

Mark 3
31Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. 32And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

And to what degree the dividing line is between an antichrist and a non-believer, that’s not an easy question to answer.

Is a person that swears by using the name of Christ an antichrist? I doubt it. They may not even realize what they’re doing. Ignorance. So what makes an enemy of Christ? Well, I think I’ve already given what I think is a reasonable answer. Can an enemy of Christ be a good person? I think I’ve answered that also.

Are atheists the enemies of Christ? Are they antichrists? To some degree I would say probably so even though they themselves would be unlikely to say so. But again, I think if you want to measure it, it’s in degrees. If someone is not out in open opposition then it comes up much lower on the scale.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. I’m open to re-evaluate based on evidence otherwise.

Regards,
MG

Well I appreciate you responding. It certainly felt to me like there was something in between agreeing with the scriptures to not agreeing. I think I'm following you enough. I suppose my issue continues though. If someone is a decent or good person and doesn't think Jesus is the Christ, may even find reason to declare unbelief in various venues because, it appears, belief isn't really doing the good many assume and may be the cause of many problems then it seems many a believer is told without exception that such a person is against God and should be seen as enemy.

So there's this faux creation of enemy happening. Probably largely because modern day believers are trained to think as much due to archaic perspectives which are assumed to be God-breathed notions. Why should you or Dan see gemli as an enemy when all he is doing is exploring ideas through conversation? Well, simply because they are told to see him as enemy, apparently. This seems only exacerbated by the internal struggle believers must feel when they encounter decent or good people who are simply wishing them well, though disagreeing, and yet are told to see them as enemy.

"They are not with God, but they are nice and are trying to be good...but God says they are opposed to him and are so bad they are called anti-Christ..." Sounds rough. WOudnl't wish your struggles on others. And, as luck would have it, you don't need to live with this turmoil. Just give it up, realizing your belief is not.

[Lem]

....So there's this faux creation of enemy happening. Probably largely because modern day believers are trained to think as much due to archaic perspectives which are assumed to be God-breathed notions. Why should you or Dan see gemli as an enemy when all he is doing is exploring ideas through conversation? Well, simply because they are told to see him as enemy, apparently. This seems only exacerbated by the internal struggle believers must feel when they encounter decent or good people who are simply wishing them well, though disagreeing, and yet are told to see them as enemy.

Well said. I appreciate gemli's posts and his way of rolling with the 'enemy creation' he faces (especially from the Midge, but that's a different category, I suspect). He uses humor a lot, and I appreciate the gentle way he deflects a lot of the faux-ness of it.

"They are not with God, but they are nice and are trying to be good...but God says they are opposed to him and are so bad they are called anti-Christ..." Sounds rough. WOudnl't wish your struggles on others. And, as luck would have it, you don't need to live with this turmoil. Just give it up, realizing your belief is not.

You are quite empathic to that internal struggle, thank you for articulating it. It helps.

And, since this is a thread titled "gemli's gems," (!) let me quote a relevant post of his, humorous approach and all:

gemli DanielPeterson a day ago

If I lecture you at all (and I haven't received the check, by the way) it's to say the answer will never be a deity or any other "being," any more than water boils because the devil is taking a bath.

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... 5190851138

[Gadianton]

it's to say the answer will never be a deity or any other "being," any more than water boils because the devil is taking a bath.

Lol! The devil taking a bath. I'm dying!

But seriously, there is some real truth here. Imagine Kiwi, DCP, and LM on a camping trip in the mountains. They are famished, and get a pot on the stove to boil. Kiwi being the more numerically capable of the lot calculates the water will boil in 7 minutes given the altitude, the volume of water and the BTU rating of the stove. But lo, it boils in 4.5 minutes. Kiwi checks his number and can get it down to 6.5 minutes at best. DCP and LM both check the calculations and are convinced no mistake could possibly have been made, and so how to account for the difference?

How many similar stories has DCP told where something can't be explained, therefore God? Everything from biological structures, to Early Modern English, to accounting ledgers of poor people who paid their tithing. As much as Gemli gets despised at SeN for caricaturing religion, to the extent that religion is something other than god-of-the-gaps, it has never been properly grounded as such at SeN. Gemli is precisely describing Mormonism as it is believed by the apologists on SeN.

[Doctor Scratch]

How many similar stories has DCP told where something can't be explained, therefore God? Everything from biological structures, to Early Modern English, to accounting ledgers of poor people who paid their tithing. As much as Gemli gets despised at SeN for caricaturing religion, to the extent that religion is something other than god-of-the-gaps, it has never been properly grounded as such at SeN. Gemli is precisely describing Mormonism as it is believed by the apologists on SeN.

My personal favorite of those DCP stories is the one where he said one of his kids had a piece of meat or something like that stuck in their throat, and DCP said a prayer or gave the kid a blessing, and *POOF*! The meat was dislodged! I can certainly empathize with the sense of relief DCP must have felt, but then again, DCP himself has said that he avoids telling that story to most people because he's afraid they will make fun of him for it.

[honorentheos]

The Christ-myth posits that humanity needs a savior. This originated out of a tribal religious community that viewed itself as God's chosen struggling with prolonged periods of subjugation to more powerful states with what they viewed to be hedonistic and pagan religious beliefs. The Christ-myth arose out of the need to blame self and others for this captivity by lesser peoples. It's never been based on reality or interested in facts. It rejects the idea there truly is a season for everything and instead dreams of perpetual spring for the chosen and winter for everyone else.

The belief that this being would be a literal conqueror who was God's champion is baked into the concept. It doesn't matter that modern Christians believe humanity needs saved from vice and sin rather than kings and armies. Why? Because they define being human as vicious and fallen and maintained that to be a savior Christ must be a conqueror.

So Christ is at war with humanity and those who believe this myth foresee a day when every knee will bow to him and every tongue confess him their Lord. And why? Because they need saved from being a human being, part of this universe as it exists, for loving and living too much, for being willing to say I don't know rather than I believe. For appreciating the fact life is a mystery but against all odds we get to live it.

Christ as savior is an enemy to humanity. Don't like reading that? Consider how few human beings have lived in cultural settings that fit under the christian label. Consider that conversion to Christianity is an act of violence to ones culture and demands abandoning ones father, brothers mother and sister if needs be. I am anti Christ. I am pro humanity. I honor the god within myself. Within you. Within us all.

[Moksha]

It may be interesting to read the anti-Christ pages again and then determine who in Joseph Smith" world fit that type of description. Are we talking Korihor, Nehor, umm...who else?

Donald Trump, Sidney Powell, Mike Flynn, Rudy Giuliani.

[honorentheos]

It may be interesting to read the anti-Christ pages again and then determine who in Joseph Smith" world fit that type of description. Are we talking Korihor, Nehor, umm...who else?

Donald Trump, Sidney Powell, Mike Flynn, Rudy Giuliani.

All enabled by the Christ myth.

MG has also informed us elsewhere he comes here to do battle. Battle against what? Against people who don't share his belief in a creator god and liberal culture.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

I think I’m anti-Christ. At least ideologically. I have no idea if I would’ve liked the person based off the mythology - probably not, if I’m being honest. I can’t think of many preachers that tickle my cockles. But, yeah. My anti-Christ reasons follow:

- Not a huge fan of a god having a chosen people, be it a Jew, a Christian, or a Nu Mason. Seems kind of petty, and the chosen people tend to be terrible. What was that Old Testament story where the Jews circumcised another tribe and then killed them while their dicks were healing? Always with the massacres those chosen peoples... I’m against that.

- And then the Jewish god had sex with Mary while she was asleep, or not, or whatever. Seems kind of a rapey way to come into the world. I’m against that.

- And then Jesus never had good theodicy. He was all, “Dad needs me to die to make up for all the evil we created and allowed to propagate. If this patch 2.1 easypeasy.exe doesn’t work I’ll just come back and reboot this crap.” I’m against that.

- But what about Jesus’ love for everyone? I dunno. Seems like dude’s love, whatever that means, is kind of manipulative and abusive. You don’t kiss his ass, well he loves you so much he made this place where you can go because you didn’t love him or ask for forgiveness for being you. I’m against that. I mean look at Midgley. If there ever were a truer disciple take my eyes because I don’t wanna see it.

- Ok. But Jesus has a church now headed up by men - definitely not women. And they have so much money for... making more money for... I dunno, the millennium or whatever. What about housing them bums and schizoids? Jesus say no? *snap* Yeah, dawg, I’m against, too.

- Ok, but what about cool new Jesus who doesn’t give crap about your facemasks, loves to beat the beat up, and adores those Molly Mo’s who bump and grind mere inches away from yo’ dick? Drop a hot take in the TiTS youtube comments section and click dislike because I’m against that.

- Doc