For Mormons and Exmormons: Object Lessons in Church

[_silentkid]

LifeOnaPlate, if you're not careful, you may get your ass handed to you on a plate.

KA

Would LOAP then become AOAP?

[_LifeOnaPlate]

Now, I've taken a hit to my credibility, LOaP? For having the personal experience of being one of hundreds of girls at YW camp? We typically had over two hundred girls attend.

How many YW's camps have you attended?

Your credibility is the one taking the hits.

LifeOnaPlate, if you're not careful, you may get your ass handed to you on a plate.

KA

Yikes, this cat has claws!

;)

My point in calling out your misrepresentations isn't to make you the fool, but to demonstrate how people have a tendency to stack the deck a little sometimes.

[_KimberlyAnn]

LifeOnaPlate, if you're not careful, you may get your ass handed to you on a plate.

KA

Would LOAP then become AOAP?

Yes.

KA

[_LifeOnaPlate]

LOaP, how can you say over on MAD that the types of object lessons described on this thread are not commonplace? They are. They are widespread. How can you deny it?

KA

Not only were these lessons taught, they still are. All they are is analogies, and Mormons love analogies. I recently attended a baptism, and one the lessons was an object lesson using a glass of water with food coloring representing sin, then the presenter put in some bleach to make the water pure again, just like baptism. Anyone who denies Mormons use objects to better present their analogies never went to church. In fact, it is a common teaching method used by non-mormons too. Nothing surprising here.

Agreed, but I really can't stomach the really awful ones (like the cupcake one, for example) and make a good attempt at curbing them when possible. ;)

[_LifeOnaPlate]

LifeOnaPlate, if you're not careful, you may get your ass handed to you on a plate.

KA

Would LOAP then become AOAP?

That's harder to pronounce.

[_KimberlyAnn]

Now, I've taken a hit to my credibility, LOaP? For having the personal experience of being one of hundreds of girls at YW camp? We typically had over two hundred girls attend.

How many YW's camps have you attended?

Your credibility is the one taking the hits.

LifeOnaPlate, if you're not careful, you may get your ass handed to you on a plate.

KA

Yikes, this cat has claws!

;)

My point in calling out your misrepresentations isn't to make you the fool, but to demonstrate how people have a tendency to stack the deck a little sometimes.

They weren't "misrepresentations". Misrepresentations usually involve a deliberate intention to deceive, and I most certainly did not do that, LOaP. You are the one now misrepresenting me, because I believe you are doing it to gain an advantage or the upper hand. I do not appreciate it nor do I take it lightly.

You haven't begun to see the claws.

If I had used the correct "peppermint" analogy, instead of the salad analogy, the number of examples I used on the MAD post would have been the same. Stacking the deck? Hardly!

Pfft!

KA

[_LifeOnaPlate]

Now, I've taken a hit to my credibility, LOaP? For having the personal experience of being one of hundreds of girls at YW camp? We typically had over two hundred girls attend.

How many YW's camps have you attended?

Your credibility is the one taking the hits.

LifeOnaPlate, if you're not careful, you may get your ass handed to you on a plate.

KA

Yikes, this cat has claws!

;)

My point in calling out your misrepresentations isn't to make you the fool, but to demonstrate how people have a tendency to stack the deck a little sometimes.

They weren't "misrepresentations". Misrepresentations usually involve a deliberate intention to deceive, and I most certainly did not do that, LOaP. You are the one now misrepresenting me, because I believe you are doing it to gain an advantage or the upper hand. I do not appreciate it nor do I take it lightly.

You haven't begun to see the claws.

If I had used the correct "peppermint" analogy, instead of the salad analogy, the number of examples I used on the MAD post would have been the same. Stacking the deck? Hardly!

Pfft!

KA

Misrepresenting something is not always a child of deceitful intentions, I do not doubt you were representing things as you honestly see them and not seeking to deceive. I do believe you skewed things by turning Alter Idem's Girls Camp experience into a presentation for "hundreds" of girls. You imputed your own experience (you say there were hundreds at your girls camp) to Alter Idem's experience unduly. For example, at my little sister's girls camp (Syracuse, Utah) there were about 40 girls there. See what I mean?

[_Zoidberg]

My husband is under 30, and he got the touched gum lesson. Sure enough, the gum represented girls, just like KA's essay said.

I was a YW for a short while since I'm a convert, but never got any lessons like that. Must be a Utah thing.

I think it's disgusting, and the natural question arises why this gum/cupcake/donut/cake never represents males. Has anyone ever had an expereience where it did?

[_LifeOnaPlate]

My husband is under 30, and he got the touched gum lesson. Sure enough, the gum represented girls, just like KA's essay said.

I was a YW for a short while since I'm a convert, but never got any lessons like that. Must be a Utah thing.

I think it's disgusting, and the natural question arises why this gum/cupcake/donut/cake never represents males. Has anyone ever had an expereience where it did?

I've had similar lessons, but it was in reference to bad parts of movies, etc.

That the examples people have mentioned are clearly slanted to show the defect as being a woman's issue is one of the biggest beefs I have with the parable, no pun intended.

[_Yoda]

LOaP, how can you say over on MAD that the types of object lessons described on this thread are not commonplace? They are. They are widespread. How can you deny it?

KA

So far we have Liz, you, Alter Idem, silentkid (his sister, apparently), mishmagnet, and truth dancer alluded to it. That is 6 people. Presume there were about 30 people involved in each lesson, we have a few hundred unfortunate souls who were subjected to this ridiculous object lesson. (At least people got cupcakes, right? Who are the cheap fools using a single piece of candy?)

I believe this type of object lesson is spread (likely through Utah, largely,) and sincerely doubt it is taught to anything near half the membership of the Church. Since it isn't in any manuals I can gratefully say this object lesson is not sanctioned by the Church, though teachers (even some with good intentions) subjected people to the nonsense. ANY time this is enacted it is a disgrace. I don't see it as "commonplace," which to me would indicate more than a few people, or even a few hundred.

Well, then, it's just a strange damned coincidence that six of us, all in different geographic regions, would be subjected to similar object lessons? I grew up in California. I believe that KA grew up in the South. I don't know where silentkid, mischmagent, and truth dancer are located, but I doubt they are all in Utah.

So, your claim that the majority of these lessons happen in Utah is bogus.

And a few hundred receiving this message is a few hundred too many.

"The worth of souls is great", remember?

I agree with KA. You better change your nickname to "Ass on a Plate". I'll be more than happy to help KA kick it there.