Problematic John Dehlin, a short list

[Kishkumen]

Mine is more an observation than a reaction. There seems to be some good parallels between his behavior and the behavior of the church and its leaders which he criticizes. It seems quite plain and this example story supports that. If that is anywhere in the realm of overreaction then convict me the evil, jealous sinner he would likely want to paint me to be.

LOL! That's pretty funny, stem. I have seen that some are eager to compare this to the LDS Church, which is a pretty wild stretch, in my opinion. I am happy to agree with you that he overreacts to criticism in certain circumstances. That seems to be one of his failings.

All the best, my good man. It's been an interesting back and forth, including the Rosebud Crap (I used the s-word to clarify) I haven't enjoyed calling all of this Crap out on his part, so I hope at some point to be freed from it.

The core issues do not make for enjoyable conversation. I don't recall another topic causing such strife here in a very long time. That is telling. It seems to me that Dehlin has predictably become a proxy for working out emotions about the LDS Church, which is one reason people are so eager to compare him to the LDS Church.

[NoManIsMyBishop]

"That is a LOT of projection going on right there! I was thinking to myself, Bitch, will you stop making us all look crazy?!, when I read on: "This happened back in January right after I had gotten a concussion."

Among other symptoms, a concussion or head injury causes confusion, memory loss, difficulty concentrating, and irritability.

Suddenly, SexyPicGate is looking more like a Facebook glitch misconstrued by someone with a very recently acquired medical condition that, by definition, causes (usually temporary) difficulties in perception, and who had had some trauma in her past to the extent that she had been uncertain for quite a long time as to whether she wanted to tell her story publicly because of the emotional toll it would take on her. I don't underestimate either factor.

It's possible that just the thought of being on the verge of publicly telling her story was beginning to trigger some PTSD-like reactions."
.
.

No. Don't you dare paint my concussion back in January as a "mental illness".
And no, don't you dare attempt to analyze my "PTSD-like reactions" (your words) you know absolutely nothing about.
Yes, I have a story to tell. My husband was a Bishop and in the Stake Presidency when we publicly left the church. My story IS very different than most apostates JD interviews. If you knew my story you'd think twice about your words here.
A concussion during the quagmire which is John Dehlin only made me "upset and confused" because 'ain't Nobody Got Time For This'. I have 5 kids and own my own business. I am active in our LGBTQ+ community and would rather focus on those things than another creepy man in my dm's. It's exhausting.
I'm tired. I'm tired of men (and women) being part of the monster that is misogyny and patriarchy. Men and women, both are victims of the system.
As a woman, I deal with unhealthy sexualization of my body daily. I can only fight so many battles. If my quiet or silence offends you, then so be it. I.don't.care.
I did speak up.... at a moment I felt it appropriate. I really don't wish to entertain this debacle any further because John Dehlin is horse crap and I don't care about him nor his virtue signaling "marvelous work and a wonder" he claims himself to be. He is a self-proclaimed Prophet for the Exmormon Community and he is messing with vulnerable people who just left a cult. His behavior should be better..... especially if he has a PhD in Psychology. He should know better. He's not stupid. He's no different than Joseph Smith.
SV, don't. Just don't.
You're not doing women or men a favor by treating me like an insane person. Geezus.
You're a devout John Dehlin follower just like the many others who leave a cult and join another one. You clearly still need a prophet in your life or you wouldn't have his back before a fellow woman who simply told her story of how JD had inappropriate behavior.

[Kishkumen]

Well, that was very enlightening.

[Chelovek]

My first thoughts on this are as follows:

I deliberately avoid liking anything on Facebook that could be misconstrued. Why? Because people will gladly read all kinds of things into those likes. So, best policy is not to like anything that could be misconstrued. May John Dehlin learn his lesson, which, unfortunately, is this: people post all kinds of things online, and often they would probably be wiser not to post them. If I am going to sit and sift through who liked certain photos I posted and then get all paranoid about what those likes might mean, then I will stop myself before posting those pictures because I don't want the headache and worry.

Evidently, this person discovered that she would take the time to figure out John Dehlin's pattern of liking her pictures and then concluded, without discussing this with him, that his purposes were to lust after her and perhaps even stalk or otherwise pursue her. Personally, I wouldn't want that kind of worry. There are a number of possible solutions here. Block any guy who likes in this way. Stop posting pictures that Facebook "friends" might like in this way that makes me feel uncomfortable. Etc.

What absolutely blows my effing mind is that this became a thing beyond her own personal discomfort and discussion with John Dehlin. My jaw is on the ground.

W. T. F.

Thank you for the education. I feel very affirmed in my decision not to ever like anything in a way that could be misconstrued. I feel very affirmed in my decision to think three times about how I interact with women online. Believe me, I do. And so far, I have done a damn good job. But it still is great to see as a negative example how some schlub can be racked publicly for liking, or, heaven forefend, re-liking a bikini picture that a female friend voluntarily posted out to every one of her barely known associates in the wide world of the internet.

I never want to know who this woman is, but, that said, I am dying to know what her security settings were and how many Facebook friends she had at the time whom she knew nothing of. Because, as vulgar as it is, the practical issue really presents itself: were any of these creeps masturbating to her pictures while John Dehlin, that cur of a worthless sexist piece of garbage who hates women, liked those "sexy" pictures TWICE(?!?!?!?!?!?) and sent her into a tailspin?

Unflippingbelievable. I am staying in my cardboard box.

By the way, the other day my wife came up to me with a picture on Facebook posted by one of our mutual friends. It was a picture of this nice lady in a bikini. My spouse has commented in the past that this person is, well, rather buxom. My spouse was aghast and laughing away at the fact this woman thinks nothing of posting this stuff on Facebook. I noticed that picture before my wife did. I did not spend any time looking at it, and you had better believe I did not comment on it to my spouse, let alone "like" it.

Because, you see, I'm not an effing idiot.

Hello! I'm this "nice lady's" husband. Let me set you and your wife straight. Her page is private and only her friends can view her post. Being body positive is very important to both of us and neither of us has ever had a problem when a picture of her in a bikini is liked by her social media friends. That's normal and expected. My wife is the bravest person I know. I've seen how because of her bravery in posting body positive pics of herself it has helped so many others struggling with their own self image. She is thanked constantly in her DM's for her bravery. You will never meet a more honest and sincere person in your life. John took advantage of our friendship. She didn't just "go into a tailspin" as you flippantly stated. We've been talking with John over the past four years about doing an interview for his podcast. We have a message thread on messenger with John, Margi, myself and my wife that we all commented on every so often. We were not ready for an interview quite yet and kept pushing it off. In the meantime I felt we had all become friends. Our story is unique...I was a bishop and in the stake presidency when we left the church. To those around us it must have looked like we did a full 180 degree turn! To us it was a long time building up including an attempted suicide of one of our 5 children strictly related to them being raised in the church as a child of a church leader. Members only see the glory of being a bishop and can't even begin to comprehend the actual sacrifice it is. I was in my 20s as a bishop and early 30s (with children from todler to teen) in the SP. We were all in, 100%. Being able to tell our story on Mormon stories podcast was very important to us...... So when John decided to wake up one morning and sexualize her pics in a barrage THREE TIMES. It hurt!!! How do you look at someone in an interview setting and talk about the things we would talk about after this?!!!! How? You cannot! We both feel betrayed and hurt by John. He knew better.

THIS IS WHAT HE DID:
He barrage liked mostly her sexy pics on both Instagram and Facebook from over a years worth of post. He cherry picked mostly sexy pics that he had previously already liked....he unliked them, then liked them again. This happened ALL AT ONCE. He did this THREE TIMES OVER THREE DAYS. If it was just her posting pics and him liking them as they are posted that would be normal. She woke up to a BARRAGE of John Dehlin's "likes" of these pics. That's not normal. If you don't agree.... Do it! I dare you to go on a married woman's page, someone who you are friends with both her and her husband, go back over a year and only like her more sexy pics. It's got to be at least 30 at once. Do it on both her Facebook & Instagram. Be sure on Facebook to only like the ones her husband is not tagged in. Let that sit a day...then do it again....then let it sit and do it a third time! Yeah....you would be creepy for sure! This is exactly what John Dehlin did. I saw it first hand. It caught us both totally off guard! John's behavior is completely unjustified except in the case of him trying to flirt or get attention. He knows us. He knows we are monogomus and he should have known this was NOT OK. I'm still in shock he did this and can't understand why. His actions afterwards we're even worse. John's no different than Joseph Smith or Brigham Young. A predator in a position of power. Why is she being picked apart over him?!!!!

[Chelovek]

*were

[NoManIsMyBishop]

SV,
No. Don't you dare paint my concussion back in January as a "mental illness".
And no, don't you dare attempt to analyze my "PTSD-like reactions" (your words) you know absolutely nothing about.
Yes, I have a story to tell. My husband was a Bishop and in the Stake Presidency when we publicly left the church. My story IS very different than most apostates John Dehlin interviews. If you knew my story you'd think twice about your words here.
A concussion during the quagmire which is John Dehlin only made me "upset and confused" because 'ain't Nobody Got Time For This'. I have 5 kids and own my own business. I am active in our LGBTQ+ community and would rather focus on those things than another creepy man in my dm's. It's exhausting.
I'm tired. I'm tired of men (and women) being part of the monster that is misogyny and patriarchy. Men and women, both are victims of the system.
As a woman, I deal with unhealthy sexualization of my body daily. I can only fight so many battles. If my quiet or silence offends you, then so be it. I.don't.care.
I did speak up.... at a moment I felt it appropriate. I really don't wish to entertain this debacle any further because John Dehlin is horse Crap and I don't care about him nor his virtue signaling "marvelous work and a wonder" he claims himself to be. He is a self-proclaimed Prophet for the Exmormon Community and he is messing with vulnerable people who just left a cult. His behavior should be better..... especially if he has a PhD in Psychology. He should know better. He's not stupid. He's no different than Joseph Smith.
SV, don't. Just don't.
You're not doing women or men a favor by treating me like an insane person. Geezus.
You're a devout John Dehlin follower just like the many others who leave a cult and join another one. You clearly still need a prophet in your life or you wouldn't have his back before a fellow woman who simply told her story of how John Dehlin had inappropriate behavior.

[Kishkumen]

Hello! I'm this "nice lady's" husband. Let me set you and your wife straight. Her page is private and only her friends can view her post. Being body positive is very important to both of us and neither of us has ever had a problem when a picture of her in a bikini is liked by her social media friends. That's normal and expected. My wife is the bravest person I know. I've seen how because of her bravery in posting body positive pics of herself it has helped so many others struggling with their own self image. She is thanked constantly in her DM's for her bravery. You will never meet a more honest and sincere person in your life. John took advantage of our friendship. She didn't just "go into a tailspin" as you flippantly stated. We've been talking with John over the past four years about doing an interview for his podcast. We have a message thread on messenger with John, Margi, myself and my wife that we all commented on every so often. We were not ready for an interview quite yet and kept pushing it off. In the meantime I felt we had all become friends. Our story is unique...I was a bishop and in the stake presidency when we left the church. To those around us it must have looked like we did a full 180 degree turn! To us it was a long time building up including an attempted suicide of one of our 5 children strictly related to them being raised in the church as a child of a church leader. Members only see the glory of being a bishop and can't even begin to comprehend the actual sacrifice it is. I was in my 20s as a bishop and early 30s (with children from todler to teen) in the SP. We were all in, 100%. Being able to tell our story on Mormon stories podcast was very important to us...... So when John decided to wake up one morning and sexualize her pics in a barrage THREE TIMES. It hurt!!! How do you look at someone in an interview setting and talk about the things we would talk about after this?!!!! How? You cannot! We both feel betrayed and hurt by John. He knew better.

I wasn't being flippant, Chelovek. I was presented with very partial information. All I could do under the circumstances was share my opinion, as any normal person would. I am happy to hear that you are so proud of your spouse and that you think so highly of her. I believe you when you say you were very hurt by John's alleged behavior. Did you ever contact him privately to work this out?

Because, I have to say, I have really never been very keen on anyone bringing this over here to discuss. It seems like it is a really bad place to work all of this out. It sounds like your beef is with John, and yet John apparently only checks in here every once in a while. When he does, he does not participate very much. Nevertheless, this board, and its predecessor, have become places for people angry with John Dehlin to vent about their anger.

Still, it's a free country, and you are welcome to do as you like, as is Meadowchik, who claims to have had your spouse's permission to post about her unpleasant Facebook interactions with John Dehlin over here.

John's no different than Joseph Smith or Brigham Young. A predator in a position of power. Why is she being picked apart over him?!!!!

Maybe because we don't know either of you. Maybe because the claim that he is no different from two men who claimed to be prophets of God in the 19th century is really hyperbolic. Perhaps calling him a predator in a position of power is also hyperbolic?

Child molesters are rightly called predators.

Serial killers are rightly called predators.

Serial rapists are rightly called predators.

Serial Facebook likers?

Sigh.

[Lem]

"That is a LOT of projection going on right there! I was thinking to myself, Bitch, will you stop making us all look crazy?!, when I read on: "This happened back in January right after I had gotten a concussion."

Among other symptoms, a concussion or head injury causes confusion, memory loss, difficulty concentrating, and irritability.

Suddenly, SexyPicGate is looking more like a Facebook glitch misconstrued by someone with a very recently acquired medical condition that, by definition, causes (usually temporary) difficulties in perception, and who had had some trauma in her past to the extent that she had been uncertain for quite a long time as to whether she wanted to tell her story publicly because of the emotional toll it would take on her. I don't underestimate either factor.

It's possible that just the thought of being on the verge of publicly telling her story was beginning to trigger some PTSD-like reactions."
.

No. Don't you dare paint my concussion back in January as a "mental illness".
And no, don't you dare attempt to analyze my "PTSD-like reactions" (your words) you know absolutely nothing about.
Yes, I have a story to tell. My husband was a Bishop and in the Stake Presidency when we publicly left the church. My story IS very different than most apostates JD interviews. If you knew my story you'd think twice about your words here.
A concussion during the quagmire which is John Dehlin only made me "upset and confused" because 'ain't Nobody Got Time For This'. I have 5 kids and own my own business. I am active in our LGBTQ+ community and would rather focus on those things than another creepy man in my dm's. It's exhausting.
I'm tired. I'm tired of men (and women) being part of the monster that is misogyny and patriarchy. Men and women, both are victims of the system.
As a woman, I deal with unhealthy sexualization of my body daily. I can only fight so many battles. If my quiet or silence offends you, then so be it. I.don't.care.
I did speak up.... at a moment I felt it appropriate. I really don't wish to entertain this debacle any further because John Dehlin is horse crap and I don't care about him nor his virtue signaling "marvelous work and a wonder" he claims himself to be. He is a self-proclaimed Prophet for the Exmormon Community and he is messing with vulnerable people who just left a cult. His behavior should be better..... especially if he has a PhD in Psychology. He should know better. He's not stupid. He's no different than Joseph Smith.
SV, don't. Just don't.
You're not doing women or men a favor by treating me like an insane person. Geezus.
You're a devout John Dehlin follower just like the many others who leave a cult and join another one. You clearly still need a prophet in your life or you wouldn't have his back before a fellow woman who simply told her story of how JD had inappropriate behavior.

I think you meant your earlier post to look like the above, NoManIsMyBishop.

(getting the quoting format is a pain on this new board sometimes. )

[Chelovek]

Welcome, Chelovek. It sounds like your are still very upset about all of this. I regret that this has become a topic of conversation here, honestly. I don't know you guys, and this is not the way I would want to become acquainted with you or anyone else. Be that as it may, I offer my apologies for contributing to your unhappiness about this situation. I do have one question, which you are free to ignore, but what came our of you and your spouse contacting John privately to work this out? I am assuming that you guys did, but that the outcome of the private confrontation was unsatisfactory. Is that correct?

Actually we chose to just ignore it when it happened. For the first time in four years he completely stopped liking anything she posted and this went on for two months. With the exception of going back unliking then re-liking a post she had made in quoting Samantha from zelf on a shelf "nothing says innocence like burning down the printing press that exposes you". Which seemed extremely weird and almost baiting. There was a lot going on in our lives over those two months including my wife recovering from a severe concussion and opening a brick and mortar store for her new business. Of course just trying to forget something doesn't always work out that way. Especially when the perpetrator begins virtue signaling and finally when he asked on his own page for members to give practical examples of ex-Mormon mens bad behavior with ex-Mormon women she called him out. You may or may not agree with this and that doesn't really matter. It does not excuse his bad behavior nor his even worse behavior after he was exposed. Many women who stood up, asked any kind of question or even liked anything she said were deleted or blocked from his page. John Dehlin has a doctorate's in psychology and psychology therapy. Talking to him privately is actually kind of ridiculous. Bottom line.... He misbehaved and has been trying to recover ever since. The seven-page doc he sent was at 3:30 in the morning. In it he shamed us for bringing this to his "workplace" and I say shame on him for bringing it into our home. I'll say it again John Dehlin is no different than Brigham Young or Joseph Smith and only gain power with people that refuse to think he does not make mistakes and in this case a big mistake.

[Chelovek]

Hello! I'm this "nice lady's" husband. Let me set you and your wife straight. Her page is private and only her friends can view her post. Being body positive is very important to both of us and neither of us has ever had a problem when a picture of her in a bikini is liked by her social media friends. That's normal and expected. My wife is the bravest person I know. I've seen how because of her bravery in posting body positive pics of herself it has helped so many others struggling with their own self image. She is thanked constantly in her DM's for her bravery. You will never meet a more honest and sincere person in your life. John took advantage of our friendship. She didn't just "go into a tailspin" as you flippantly stated. We've been talking with John over the past four years about doing an interview for his podcast. We have a message thread on messenger with John, Margi, myself and my wife that we all commented on every so often. We were not ready for an interview quite yet and kept pushing it off. In the meantime I felt we had all become friends. Our story is unique...I was a bishop and in the stake presidency when we left the church. To those around us it must have looked like we did a full 180 degree turn! To us it was a long time building up including an attempted suicide of one of our 5 children strictly related to them being raised in the church as a child of a church leader. Members only see the glory of being a bishop and can't even begin to comprehend the actual sacrifice it is. I was in my 20s as a bishop and early 30s (with children from todler to teen) in the SP. We were all in, 100%. Being able to tell our story on Mormon stories podcast was very important to us...... So when John decided to wake up one morning and sexualize her pics in a barrage THREE TIMES. It hurt!!! How do you look at someone in an interview setting and talk about the things we would talk about after this?!!!! How? You cannot! We both feel betrayed and hurt by John. He knew better.

I wasn't being flippant, Chelovek. I was presented with very partial information. All I could do under the circumstances was share my opinion, as any normal person would. I am happy to hear that you are so proud of your spouse and that you think so highly of her. I believe you when you say you were very hurt by John's alleged behavior. Did you ever contact him privately to work this out?

Because, I have to say, I have really never been very keen on anyone bringing this over here to discuss. It seems like it is a really bad place to work all of this out. It sounds like your beef is with John, and yet John apparently only checks in here every once in a while. When he does, he does not participate very much. Nevertheless, this board, and its predecessor, have become places for people angry with John Dehlin to vent about their anger.

Still, it's a free country, and you are welcome to do as you like, as is Meadowchik, who claims to have had your spouse's permission to post about her unpleasant Facebook interactions with John Dehlin over here.

John's no different than Joseph Smith or Brigham Young. A predator in a position of power. Why is she being picked apart over him?!!!!

Maybe because we don't know either of you. Maybe because the claim that he is no different from two men who claimed to be prophets of God in the 19th century is really hyperbolic. Perhaps calling him a predator in a position of power is also hyperbolic?

Child molesters are rightly called predators.

Serial killers are rightly called predators.

Serial rapists are rightly called predators.

Serial Facebook likers?

Sigh.

A predator is always in the making and in this case it was online. You say they actually have to kill rape or molest a child and I say they become predators when they start behaving as John Dehlin did online. I said flippantly because of exactly what you just said in that you don't know us. This is all I'm going to say on the matter as it's already taken way too much time out of our lives. You have access to the seven-page docs... And I'm assuming you have access to the post on Mormon stories podcast where she called him out. You have plenty of information to create your own deductions of the situation as does anyone else who is reading this. Please do. You've now heard this side of the story.