Jersey Girl wrote...
The fetus currently has no voice. The truth is that MEN made the laws that are in place. They chose to give women the right to decide what to do with the contents of their own body and how they view those contents.
Most the laws in place where women instigated...including Roe v. Wade. If I am wrong what rules made by men are you referring too? The attorneys that started the case if i read wiki correctly were women, Linda Coffee and Sarah Weddington.
Yes they gave the women the right to choose, and yes, the baby has no choice. I am not sure how you cam blame this on men...but o'well.
Jersey Girl wrote
The crux of my position hinges on this very sentence. Read it carefully.
If you find a way to mandate abstinence, let me know. Until then, you need to face the fact that some women don't use contraception, contraceptives fail, men fail women, and sometimes women fail themselves.
And as I stated, then you believe that becasue of these reasons, it is okay to abort a baby?
How come men fail women, and only sometime women fail themselves? Unless it is rape, it takes two, and as you wrote the women does have control of her body and can say no.
That's the complete truth of the matter.
In closing let me say this, too. There are folks in this country who would extend a compassionate hand to women who discover they've become pregnant due to rape and support their choice to terminate that pregnancy. Markkkk, that fetus did absolutely nothing to deserve that either. That fetus has the same right to survive as you believe any other fetus has the right to the same. We extend a compassionate hand to a victim of rape because we don't want her to suffer further.
The hard truth is that when women give birth to children they didn't want or didn't plan for, the trajectory of their life course will be thrown off course by an unplanned pregnancy, some (note I said SOME) of those women will suffer as well and so will their child should they give birth and raise them.
When we can produce a society that ACTS on their self proclaimed compassion for the unborn, by making adoption and counseling more accessible and compassionate towards women, when you can produce a religious right that puts it's combined money where it's combined mouth is and instead of condemning women for their choice to terminate and [i]take away their resources, and rushes in to embrace them and adopt their babies...then you'll have something going that could indeed change the plight of those women and their babies and effect real change in our society.
Until then, we've got what we've got. A safe and medical way for a woman to change her circumstances. You haven't walked a mile in their moccasins and the truth is that you never will.
And women frequently suffer no matter what choice they make.
I can't take the right to choose away from another woman when I, as a part of this society, am not totally coming through for her should she choose to give birth, raise the child or adopt. I have taught her children adopted or not. I have taught both foreign and domestic adoptees. This past August I went to the celebration of life for an adopted child that I taught. That was a first for me that I hope to never repeat. I was amazed at the generosity and grace that the adoptive parents showed to the birth mother. That extension of grace will stay with me forever and so will the memory of him. He was a high spirited and vibrant boy with everything going for him, even when he was 4. I can't imagine a world without his influence in it. But I know that they had access to resources that many women lack and not everyone cherishes a new life or the birth mother who gave that life.
Well that's enough of me and my ideas here. I'm more sensitive to this topic than any other topic that ever comes up on this board for discussion. It doesn't make me angry, it breaks my heart. I've said everything I'm ever going to say about it.
Departing the thread now.
I have a adopted sister, who's mother chose not to abort, and I am grateful for that. And we can come up with emotional stories for both sides, I get that. But the reality is that baby's are dying, in the name of choice, and that a hard line to swallow, at least for me.
I understand this is a tough topic, and I understand why you don't really want to discuss it, it is not easy for me either having been involved with choices.
take care
MG
Don't take life so seriously in that " sooner or later we are just old men in funny clothes" "Tom 'T-Bone' Wolk"