"Maintaining faith in the LDS Church is a difficult task, requiring all sorts of convoluted mental gymnastics..."

[Esaias]

I was a mental gymnast for a while. Then I started having mystical experiences, similar to J.S. Jr. Then it's a who is holier than thou contest. We both met Jesus. Well, I have him as a guide in my minds eye, probably like Paul did. I think Jesus was a mystic, similar to myself, his mysteries make a lot of sense when you see into the spirit world. I'm a medium so I see a lot of parables with esoteric twists. He spoke darkly, not telling how it really was, only his inner circle, the church and public get the lesser portion.

As a medium I have made a lot of contacts in the spirit realm and we think Smith was a charlatan. Over all. Kinderhook plates. For me, he could have fabricated the plates, just like those. Who saw them? The plates story is critical and weak. The reputation of the witnesses? Really? I bet my soul on that? We think he was a compulsive liar, we get that over here in the dreamland all the time, fairy tales. Tell a yarn a saga. A story a myth, it's on them if they are gullible. Then sap energy with obedience. Like this post here regarding gymnastics who has energy for that?

Also, the copycatting, the cliché. Typical magical spirit realm stuff. Some spirits like that his family goes back generations of magic circles and parchments. See Dan Vogel's work. Monotonous but excellent scholar. Spirits copy and plagiarize all the time. Which also is strange since the charlatanry goes beyond the mortal into the spirit channeling domain. Smith was a medium like myself. Yes there are hazards, those paranoid of the occult aren't totally wrong. A labyrinth of brainwashing ingenious creativity, it must be divine. It probably is. God is liar you know, and loves to tell tales. Then you grow up, you didn't really believe me did you, kid? Just testing.

[drumdude]

I was a mental gymnast for a while. Then I started having mystical experiences, similar to J.S. Jr. Then it's a who is holier than thou contest. We both met Jesus. Well, I have him as a guide in my minds eye, probably like Paul did. I think Jesus was a mystic, similar to myself, his mysteries make a lot of sense when you see into the spirit world. I'm a medium so I see a lot of parables with esoteric twists. He spoke darkly, not telling how it really was, only his inner circle, the church and public get the lesser portion.

As a medium I have made a lot of contacts in the spirit realm and we think Smith was a charlatan. Over all. Kinderhook plates. For me, he could have fabricated the plates, just like those. Who saw them? The plates story is critical and weak. The reputation of the witnesses? Really? I bet my soul on that? We think he was a compulsive liar, we get that over here in the dreamland all the time, fairy tales. Tell a yarn a saga. A story a myth, it's on them if they are gullible. Then sap energy with obedience. Like this post here regarding gymnastics who has energy for that?

Also, the copycatting, the cliché. Typical magical spirit realm stuff. Some spirits like that his family goes back generations of magic circles and parchments. See Dan Vogel's work. Monotonous but excellent scholar. Spirits copy and plagiarize all the time. Which also is strange since the charlatanry goes beyond the mortal into the spirit channeling domain. Smith was a medium like myself. Yes there are hazards, those paranoid of the occult aren't totally wrong. A labyrinth of brainwashing ingenious creativity, it must be divine. It probably is. God is liar you know, and loves to tell tales. Then you grow up, you didn't really believe me did you, kid? Just testing.

Always interesting to see a former Mormon who embraced the spiritual realm instead of rejecting it. If you were to go by Daniel Peterson’s worldview, you should be a card carrying atheist after rejecting Joseph Smith.

[Dr. Shades]

I was a mental gymnast for a while. Then I started having mystical experiences, similar to J.S. Jr.

Which illegal substances do you use that induce your mystical experiences?

[Esaias]

I was a mental gymnast for a while. Then I started having mystical experiences, similar to J.S. Jr.

Which illegal substances do you use that induce your mystical experiences?

There is a point where they don't help much. Certainly there is a growing demand for ancient antennae altering practices. In fact I am always on the lookout for mushroom, ketamine, and marijuana stocks. The science is siding with them, so the money is starting to come in, and taxes.

I can could scry since a small boy, but it developed over time, drugs weren't what caused my "hallucinations" (dumbsciencespeak for visions that are funny illogical and dreamy but seem to connect synchronistically to the future via allegory or parable.) You have to be a parable expert to prophesy. Like unto, types and symbols. The fake and the real. What is so fascinating about Smith's wizardry is how he connected the fake (parable, lie, apocryphal) with the real historical Bible. Book of Mormon fake, Bible real. Breathing permit of Hor, fake, Book of Abraham, real. True myth in other words, a campfire story way of putting it to kids. Not to nitpick over the ancient historians too much but there was no Mormon, I mean literally the character Mormon in the book that organized the history, yet there were many Christian forefathers and founders from actual history, even if they fish storied it a little.

With scrying I got clairaudio over time. It developed to where I can during meditation have apparitions and poltergeist activity. I give my friends on the other side enough energy and they can do magic tricks. It costs blood (what the spirits call life force) to do a trick, it will hurt. Do you really want one? Kinda like it cost Book of Mormon level lie in order to channel other truths through. Gotta balance the light and dark with magic, truth and lie. In the words of Layne Staley from the Psalm Grind, we find the lyrics "and in truth your lies become one and same" My Bible consists of what Dr. Carl Jung observed in artwork. Prophecy and archetypes. I think some of my clairaudio inner ear is actual audio outer ear ghost's speaking literally, mixed with some of my own thoughts. The can be kinda loud sometimes, and there is a pattern I go through myself with them via an astral dream body, where I portal into my physical proximity, like there are two of me, I have a little astral puppet I can get in dreams and aura's with. I want to focus really hard and get some footage on film and a really sensitive mic someday. Apparitions, ghostspeak. Put it out there for the world? Who would believe me? When I am not lying and have evidence?

Spirits love looking at linearges. That Smith's family was in a Renaissance era alchemy and magic tradition appeals. Smith has a lineage. A soul family on the other side propping him up. Like other tribal magic I have seen, it works, when the right conditions are met. I don't doubt that his magic worked, but the problem is magic like everything else has to balance and only works half the time. He made some real blunders didn't he? The Jester that he was. Jovial company.

Right now I have a shot of whiskey and a quarter gram of Jenny Kush coursing through my veins, I consider myself moderate, I have no need of breaking the law, at least not when you can literally go to the weed store like a liquor store and get and 1/8th like a 5th. I got off my political protest soapbox and left it to others. No you shouldn't follow stupid laws, like Dr. Leary says, it may be God or the Devil but you have to do your own independent research and think for yourself question authority.

I love debating with skeptics. I am a skeptic myself, I know I am wrong sometimes, I have thoughts that are off, I'm humble about it. I find a lot of skepticism comical and childish, and somewhat entertaining. Usually poking fun of, like oh yeah and how high were you at the time? Or drunk? I know Freya, the black kitty cat. Nice to see her possess you and put on some shades. Hi Freya! There are no so called coincidences, and most spirits like the scripture of James Hetfield says blind you and give you another excuse. It was a coincidence. Yea right. Synchronicity. "blinded by me you can't see a thing", found in the Master of Puppets album in a song entitled just that. Also from the book of Don't Tread on Me album: "You! you Your my mask, your my cover my shelter, You! you your my mask, your the one who's blamed, Do do Do my work, do my dirtywork scapegoat!" and so on. Then betrayal at the end, Labba Sabachthani. Metallica exegesis.

My writing style kinda rambles a bit but I try to be thorough. Meticulous. I don't want to publish anything to the world otherwise, even if it's just a comment. If my longwindedness is not deleted I may hang around the board a bit.

[Esaias]

I was a mental gymnast for a while. Then I started having mystical experiences, similar to J.S. Jr. Then it's a who is holier than thou contest. We both met Jesus. Well, I have him as a guide in my minds eye, probably like Paul did. I think Jesus was a mystic, similar to myself, his mysteries make a lot of sense when you see into the spirit world. I'm a medium so I see a lot of parables with esoteric twists. He spoke darkly, not telling how it really was, only his inner circle, the church and public get the lesser portion.

As a medium I have made a lot of contacts in the spirit realm and we think Smith was a charlatan. Over all. Kinderhook plates. For me, he could have fabricated the plates, just like those. Who saw them? The plates story is critical and weak. The reputation of the witnesses? Really? I bet my soul on that? We think he was a compulsive liar, we get that over here in the dreamland all the time, fairy tales. Tell a yarn a saga. A story a myth, it's on them if they are gullible. Then sap energy with obedience. Like this post here regarding gymnastics who has energy for that?

Also, the copycatting, the cliché. Typical magical spirit realm stuff. Some spirits like that his family goes back generations of magic circles and parchments. See Dan Vogel's work. Monotonous but excellent scholar. Spirits copy and plagiarize all the time. Which also is strange since the charlatanry goes beyond the mortal into the spirit channeling domain. Smith was a medium like myself. Yes there are hazards, those paranoid of the occult aren't totally wrong. A labyrinth of brainwashing ingenious creativity, it must be divine. It probably is. God is liar you know, and loves to tell tales. Then you grow up, you didn't really believe me did you, kid? Just testing.

Always interesting to see a former Mormon who embraced the spiritual realm instead of rejecting it. If you were to go by Daniel Peterson’s worldview, you should be a card carrying atheist after rejecting Joseph Smith.

Yes I was hoping someone would notice that. I was wondering why Peterson is so right, in my case, certainly I am different. My advice for atheists is go more agnostic. You really don't know is the honest truth. Then when you get to the spirit realm, they don't either then what? Well you can put puzzle pieces together, that is what I do. I don't think even Buddha or Jesus knows "The Truth" per se. More like, the working theory based on our experiments. How can one let go of their pursuit of absolute truth? I think if we had it, we wouldn't have motivation to be creative. I am siding with it's all a dream, we create our own universes, and laws therin, and so called truths. Lucidity properly developed, helps to see and therefore control more universe powers and create our karma. My official spirit practice could be called dream yoga I suppose. My joke is I put as much effort into my spiritual practice as falling asleep. I am my own guru. I advise people to seek independent truths and not rely on other prophets/gurus. It could be that they are all gods (psalm 82:5) and perhaps we step on each others toes a bit. Keep distant, god, I'm god you know, not you. Well, I have my own universe created with my lucidity and you have yours. If one world rolls into existence after another perishes, like Mormonism claims, then there is a multiverse, like modern science claims. In fact I take the devil's advocate so far to say that in fairyland (it so happens to be a dream realm, I live there myself) there might even be a Nephi. Perhaps it was true. Who knows. It's a multiverse what do you do? Well that doesn't mean there was a priesthood restoration and literal gold plates in my universe. But yours? Who knows.

Also anecdotal, I play drums too drum dude. Ever heard of Blue Man Group? They are not a band but a live show in Vegas. Tons of drummers, 3 shows a day, that would be fun eh?

[Gadianton]

Esaias,

An atheist doesn't have to "know" there isn't a God, an atheist just doesn't believe there is one. Presumably, the typical atheist believes they have good objective reasoning for that, but not necessarily. Could merely be disillusionment or hardships. An agnostic doesn't have an opinion on whether there is a God. Sometimes, agnostics might say they are "agnostic because they don't know" but that tells me they probably haven't thought about it much. If they don't have an opinion one way or another, then I think it makes sense to claim to be an agnostic. Many who claim to be agnostic are probably atheists, and might realize that if they thought about terminology a little bit more.

As for your descriptions of the spirit realm, it brings me back to reading the timeless wisdom of Ophial back in my youth.

[drumdude]

Also anecdotal, I play drums too drum dude. Ever heard of Blue Man Group? They are not a band but a live show in Vegas. Tons of drummers, 3 shows a day, that would be fun eh?

Nice! I don’t play as much as I used to. I have seen blue man group back when I was a teenager, they were great!

[malkie]

Also anecdotal, I play drums too drum dude. Ever heard of Blue Man Group? They are not a band but a live show in Vegas. Tons of drummers, 3 shows a day, that would be fun eh?

Nice! I don’t play as much as I used to. I have seen blue man group back when I was a teenager, they were great!

What could be better than Blue Man Group?

Blue Man Group with Venus Hum:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iFBXjRbVl0